Hansard Mar.9/2005-QP: Justice, Terrorism, Border Security -- Apparently, It's Question Period -- Not Answer Period

Four dead Mounties deserve answers and making sure the problems are fixed -- staff shortages, lenient sentences and a useless gun registry that didn't protect them.

The government keeps drilling in the public's mind they have put $8 billion into security. They didn't -- it's just a promise -- like the military's $13 billion -- maybe down the road. Most of the money went into such things where there was deferred maintenance and functional obsolescence in communications and computer equipment. This should have been upgraded yearly like most companies do. The government let the RCMP starve for this equipment for years and then made an a big announcement for PR purposes. $8 billion sounds better than $1.5 billion/year for maximum PR effect. The question is: how many officers, above the attrition level, have been hired with that "$8 billion" -- 5000 officers or 200 officers? They keep reorganizing, reviewing, studying, producing reports -- evrything but acting and actually fixing the problems. When the funerals are over, they have a lot to answer for.


Hansard Mar.9/2005-QP

http://www.parl.gc.ca/38/1/parlbus/chambus/house/debates/068_2005-03-09/ques068-E.htm

Justice

Hon. Stephen Harper (Leader of the Opposition, CPC): Mr. Speaker, as the days pass, more information is coming to light about last week's shooting of four Mounties in Alberta.

This appears to be another example of an individual with a long history of criminal charges, complaints and convictions, but who rarely found himself in prison.

The justice minister has said that mandatory minimum sentencing is not an option for such individuals. I wonder if this opinion is shared by the Prime Minister.

Right Hon. Paul Martin (Prime Minister, Lib.): Mr. Speaker, what occurred is obviously a tremendous human tragedy. All of us, the Leader of the Opposition, many members here and I will have the opportunity in Edmonton tomorrow to say to the families just how deeply troubled and deeply sorrowful we feel.

As the hon. member knows, there is an investigation ongoing by the RCMP on this particular matter and we obviously should wait for the results of that.

That being said, it does raise a number of wider issues. Those wider issues are ones that are being addressed by the minister.

Hon. Stephen Harper (Leader of the Opposition, CPC): Mr. Speaker, all the information to this point certainly suggests that in this case the individual in question had a long history of dangerous and threatening behaviour.

He was viewed as dangerous not just by the authorities, but he was viewed as dangerous by anyone who came into contact with him, by the entire community and by his own family. At the same time, it appears no one ever considered registering him as a dangerous offender because of the difficulty in doing so.

Is the government prepared to look at dangerous offender legislation to see if it can be made somewhat more effective?

Hon. Irwin Cotler (Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada, Lib.): Mr. Speaker, at the recent meeting of the federal, provincial and territorial ministers of justice, we referred the matter of dangerous offenders to a working group in that regard. They will be reporting back to us in June 2005.

Hon. Stephen Harper (Leader of the Opposition, CPC): Mr. Speaker, let me ask one final question.

It is self-evident that last week's multiple murder tragedy was not in any way prevented or impeded by the gun registry, although the gun registry was brought into effect primarily to deal with precisely this kind of tragedy.

After spending $1 billion, does the government have any evidence at all that the registry would prevent this kind of tragedy in the future?

Hon. Anne McLellan (Deputy Prime Minister and Minister of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness, Lib.): Mr. Speaker, first let me say that obviously this is a very tragic event and there is a criminal investigation ongoing. As well, the RCMP is looking internally at what happened.

It is incumbent upon all of us to await the outcome of those investigations and reviews before we start leaping to conclusions. It is unfortunate that the opposition has chosen at this time to leap to conclusions before we have all the facts.

[Asking the obvious questions is what Canadians expect our opposition to do Ms. MacLellan. NJC]

* * *

Terrorism

Mr. Peter MacKay (Central Nova, CPC): We have come to the conclusion, Mr. Speaker, that the gun registry is a colossal failure and does not save lives.

Last week the director of CSIS, Jim Judd, told a Senate committee that the agency was considering recommending outlawing the Tamil Tigers as a terrorist organization in Canada. The United States, Great Britain and Australia have all done so.

Judd says Canada is hesitating because the foreign affairs minister is concerned that listing the Tigers might upset a peace process in Sri Lanka. [my italics NJC]

Could the Minister of Public Safety tell us what is more important, shutting down a terrorist organization in Canada or offending somebody outside the country? Who makes the final decision, her or the foreign affairs minister?

Hon. Anne McLellan (Deputy Prime Minister and Minister of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness, Lib.): Mr. Speaker, first let me make it absolutely plain, if any organization in this country carries out any terrorist activity as defined in the Criminal Code, we will proceed against that organization. Let me be absolutely clear about that.

We review on a regular and ongoing basis the possibility of listing organizations. That review process continues.

I take very seriously the input I receive and the risk assessments I receive from organizations such as CSIS and the RCMP.

(1425)

Mr. Peter MacKay (Central Nova, CPC): Mr. Speaker, in some cases dithering causes death.

[Translation]

Yesterday the Minister of Transport did not want to explain why a computer system could not be set up in airports to monitor terrorists.

Would the Minister of Transport explain why police agencies have to rely on luck, when a computerized system could ensure the safety of Canadians?

Hon. Jean Lapierre (Minister of Transport, Lib.): Mr. Speaker, I had a hard time understanding the question in French. I can tell you that airport security is assured with as many means as possible. However, we are also developing a special list to keep certain people off flights. If that is what the hon. member wanted to know, this is absolutely the case. We are currently working on a no fly list.

[How many years after 9/11 does it take to ask the RCMP and CSIS for their input and to use it? Or might that have repercussions on leaders and/or spokesmen for politically identifiable voting communities? NJC]

* * *

Border Security

Mr. Russ Hiebert (South Surrey—White Rock—Cloverdale, CPC): Mr. Speaker, a CBC report yesterday focused on illegal border crossings in my riding. People are just walking across the border at the Peace Arch crossing while the new border service is powerless to do anything. Officers cannot arrest suspects more than 100 feet away and so must call the police, who face the challenge of arriving before these illegals vanish.

The U.S. border service has doubled the enforcement on its side and the power to arrest people anywhere. How many more dangerous weapons and narcotics is the Deputy Prime Minister going to allow across the border before she acts?
(1505)

Hon. Anne McLellan (Deputy Prime Minister and Minister of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness, Lib.): Mr. Speaker, in fact we have acted. The amount of money that we have put into the newly created CBSA, Canada Border Services Agency, speaks to the government's commitment. In fact, the Minister of Finance provided significant additional resources in this budget to ensure that we can increase the number of officers on our borders.

[$$$ put into or promised? NJC]

I also want to reassure the hon. member that we do ongoing job safety and hazard analysis to ensure that our border agents have the tools they need to keep--

The Speaker: The time for question period has expired.


[How convenient -- no real answers will be given so the Speaker calls an end to inconvenient questions -- Question Period as it is. NJC]